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I am looking for my 4th great grandparents Samuel Gilmore & Mary (Smith) Gilmore. They immigrated to the USA in the auspicious year of 1798. I am pretty positive that they were Presbyterians.
I'll be visiting Northern Ireland in September 2024, so I'm trying to gather as much info as possible about my relatives ahead of time. (If I'm very lucky, I may find out when and where in Scotland they came from, assuming they were Ulster Scots.)
All I have to go on is the following:
"Transcribed from the 'Boston Transcript' genealogy column of Aug. 25, 1932: "5074.2. BELL, CODNER, TWIST. N.C.D.C. Aug. 3, 1932.
Samuel & Mary (Smith) Gilmore, with three sons, three daughters, and four grandchildren, arrived at Philadelphia from Tyrone, Ireland in September, 1798.
Their eldest daughter Mary, and her husband, William Bell, brought two of the grandchildren: Thomas, born Jan. 1, 1796, who married, 1820, Anne Van Giesen and had four daughters, died June 11, 1878, at Sennett; and Samuel, born March, 1798, married, 1822, Mary (Polly) Codner. Their children: Lucy, born 1823, died 1891, in Iowa, married a Baldwin; Mary, married Elija Talmadge; Julia, married Erie T. ward; William, married and had a family; Caroline, married a Young; Margaret, married (second wife) Erie T. Ward; Henry, killed in Michigan; Hattie, never married; and Charles.

Any assistance would be GREATLY appreciated.

James Gilmore
Dunsmuir, California, USA

JamesGilmore

Sunday 24th Mar 2024, 10:48PM

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  •  

    James,

    The likely religious denomination, the location ie Tyrone and the Scottish surname all point to the Gilmore family being Ulster Scots. As does migration in the 1700s. Most of the emigrants from Ireland in the 1700s were Presbyterians from Ulster. "Native Irish" if that's a suitable term, didn't really start migrating in large numbers till the 1800s. So your analysis of their origins as Scotland seems sound. And they almost certainly arrived in the 1600s.

    Samuel & Mary arrived with children and grandchildren, so they must have married around the mid 1750s or thereabouts. Their children probably were born c 1770s and grandchildren in the 1790s. Something like that. There are very few records in Ireland for the 1700s and tracing families like this is notoriously difficult. In general, prior to the start of statutory birth and death registration (1864) we rely on church records, where they exist. As far as Presbyterians in Tyrone are concerned, there are almost no baptism or marriage records for the 1700s, anywhere in the county. Plus Presbyterians generally didn't keep burial records. Without any more information than that they came from Co Tyrone, it will be very difficult to research them. Probably DNA testing is the best route, in the hope that you match with someone who knows more about the family's origins.

    Philip Robinson's book "The Plantation of Ulster" is a widely acknowledged authority on the Scots migration. You might find it interesting. As far as Tyrone is concerned, many of the Scots arrived by sea at the port of Derry/Londonderry before fanning out across Tyrone and adjacent counties. Many came from places like Ayrshire and Renfrewshire. They tended to come from the southern half of Scotland rather than the Highlands. Highlanders weren't encouraged to come in case their loyalties were suspect but also their background meant they weren't used to lowland farming practices and so Ireland appealed slightly less to them in terms of employment prospects.

    Eagles Wings - the story of the Scots-Irish or Ulster-Scots by Dr David Hume is another helpful read. It traces the Scots arrival in Ireland in the 1600s and explains their reasons for leaving again in the 1700s (a mix of political and economic factors, much the same as most modern migration).

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Monday 25th Mar 2024, 06:34AM
  • Elwyn, thanks so much for this response.
    I had noticed a dearth of info regarding pre-1800 baptism and marriage records, but I chalked it up to the fact that I'm doing my research from the States. Must admit it's a tad discouraging to hear that Presbyterian records are nearly nonexistent.
    I did find this site: https://www.failteromhat.com/flax1796.php - where there's a Samuel Gilmore listed as a flax farmer in Tamlacht O'Crilly, in County Derry. There are also a few Gilmore flax farmers in County Tyrone (Dromore and Drumragh). I'm wondering if the geographic borders for the counties in Northern Ireland have been hard and fast, or if perhaps they might have been redrawn since 1798?
    There is also a reference to a Samuel Gilmore in the 1766 Tullyniskan census. Again, not in County Tyrone, but in Ballymeana, County Antrim. https://www.cotyroneireland.com/census/1766Tullyniskan.html
    As far as reading material, your references look quite interesting as far as Scots migration history. For now I'm trying to concentrate on finding Samuel's Irish history, and then perhaps tracking him down in Scotland. Perhaps it's a fool's errand, but it's a great excuse to travel! I am quite ignorant as to the history of  the Rebellion of 1798, but I find it interesting that he immigrated after that fateful summer. I've secured a first edition of Thomas Parkenham's "The Year of Liberty," and I'm looking forward to a deep dive into that history. Have you any other suggestions for books on that subject?
    Once again, thank you so much for your efforts!
    Sláinte,
    James

    JamesGilmore

    Tuesday 26th Mar 2024, 05:19AM
  • Also, can anyone suggest one of the DNA tests for ancestry? It's all a bit confusing when it comes to choices... which might offer me the best chance for more information regarding Samuel and Mary? Any pointers appreciated.
    James

    JamesGilmore

    Tuesday 26th Mar 2024, 05:25AM
  • James,

    There was no change to the borders between Derry & Tyrone in the period that you are interested in. Derry (which used to be named the County of Coleraine until the early 1600s) had some changes in the very early 1600s but they only affected Donegal and Antrim. Not Tyrone. And were 200 years earlier anyway.

    Bear in mind that the spelling of the surname will have varied all the time so keep an open mind on Gilmore/Gilmour/Gilmoore and other possibilities.

    Looking at the Muster Rolls c 1630 (published by RJ Hunter) I see about 13 Gilmores in Ulster then. Several in Derry/Londonderry and Donegal. Just one in Tyrone – a James Gilmour – who lived somewhere on the Abercorn estate, in the barony of Strabane. He had a sword and a pike which indicated he was not too badly off. (The number and type of weapons you had generally reflected your economic position). So, you know there was at least one Gilmore family in Tyrone in the 1630s.

    Re the other Gilmores in Derry and Antrim, it was a common surname. In the 1901 Irish census there were over 3000 people named Gilmore (including variants) of which 52 were named Samuel. It would have been almost  just as common in the 1700s.

    Regarding tracing back to Scotland, it’s rare but it can occasionally be done. Usually with families that had a bit of land and money and so left a few records behind (leases, wills and gravestones). Gravestones were not common in the 1600s. Only very wealthy people had them. But I did attend a lecture a year or two back where a Boyd family in North East Antrim who arrived around 1610 had successfully traced their roots to Kilmarnock in Ayrshire and had found a living descendant in London, but from Kilmarnock originally, whose DNA matched the Irish branch.

    You ask about DNA. The North of Ireland Family History Society is running a special DNA project focussing on Ulster families. You might want to participate. You don’t need to be an NIFHS member, if you don’t want. You can send them your DNA (they have test kits at a special prices) and contribute your DNA to the project. Martin McDowell their Education Officer runs courses on how to use DNA effectively.

    Home - NIFHS.org

    You ask about the United Irishmen, and wonder whether your family left because of the uprising. The uprising started on 7th June 1798 and was over a few days later. Your family arrived in Philadelphia in September. A typical Atlantic crossing then was 6 to 8 weeks. So they may have left Ireland in July 1798. They could have bene involved in or affected by the uprising. On the other hand plans for migration often took some months to organise, especially if a property had to be sold, tickets booked etc. So it’s possible they were already planning to leave before the uprising.

    You ask about publications on the 1798 rebellion. It gets a few pages in Richard Killeen’s “A short history of modern Ireland,” but there are other more detailed books available (often at a hefty price). It was an attempt to overthrow the Government and was seen as treason (understandably). Martial law was declared and the British authorities responded fairly ruthlessly. The United Irishmen were full of informers and so the authorities knew roughly what would happen and prepared accordingly. The United Irishmen hadn’t many weapons and little military experience so they were beaten fairly easily. In addition, though there was strong support in some parts of Ireland, not everyone did and so that contributed to the defeat too. Many Presbyterians supported the United Irishmen then but soon after the organisation collapsed and ironically by the early and mid-1800s most Presbyterians were happy to be loyal to the Crown again, especially as the economy in the north benefited a little from the Industrial Revolution and a generally improved economy. Today the average Presbyterian in what is now Northern Ireland is extremely loyal to the British Crown. Most don’t see themselves as Irish at all, but British.

    The Flax Growers list is a useful tool but it’s not a census. Not every household grew flax and so many folk in Ireland in 1796 won’t be listed. Until the American War of Independence, many weavers had woven cotton which was imported from the Carolinas (it won’t grow in Ireland. Too cold and wet). The British blockaded the Carolina ports and so cotton supplies stopped. Consequently, the weavers needed an alternative source of cotton or a different product. They did use wool but found that linen was more in demand. Linen comes from the flax plant which does grow well in Ireland, and so the authorities encouraged flax growing and gave financial incentives i.e. free spinning wheels. But to be on that flax growers list you needed a few acres of land, so it’s mostly a list of farmers. The average labourer or someone living in a town without any land normally wouldn’t be able to qualify. Do you know what your family’s occupation was in Ireland? That may tell you whether to expect them on the flax grower lists.

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Wednesday 27th Mar 2024, 06:45AM

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