Searching for Mary Smith

Hi Alan,

I searched rootsireland.ie baptisms/irths for Mary Smith father Geroge born 1858 + - 1 and got 3 matches all SmYth: Derry, Armagh and Armagh. Itried for James with father George 1858 + - 5 and got 2 Cavan & Wicklow! 

If you google South Australia BDM you'l  get a site to search. The marriage is there and you can pay to get the info - hopefully Mary's parents' names would be on there and you could then search rootsireland.ie for Mary & James's births. 

Col

Hi Col,
Many thanks for taking the time to do those searches. Sorry I
haven't replied earlier, but to be honest I wasn't expecting such a quick
reply.
You have pretty much hit the nail on the head when you recommended that I
search the South Aus BDM for additional info on Mary Smith's marriage
certificate. Problem is the genealogy data on all SA BDM documents at this
time was minimal. I received a copy of this certificate some time ago and
all thats on there is her age and fathers name.
I don't think I am going to solve this one until I get her mothers name- but
how to get this? I was aware of the Mary Smyth data on Roots Ireland, but its
hard to distinguish between the 3 possibilities unless you alredy know the
place of birth or mothers maiden name.

If there was a marriage notice in the SA newspapers, this would have given
details of her father ...eg..the bride Mary Smith daughter of George Smith of
Adelaide or London or Dublin or whatever. But it seems her husband didn't
bother to lodge a notice.

If Mary Wiese nee Smith had been admitted to hospital in SA this would have
generated a lot of good data, eg. place of birth, years in Aust and maybe
even name of parents. But it seems she gave birth at home and died in her own
bed. The emmigration / shipping records for SA are also pretty poor.
So it looks like a hard battle to get more information on Mary Smith - even
the name makes it hard.
Once again thanks for taking the time to help out. Appreciate hearing any further thoughts you may have
regards
Alan
Sorry to duplicate the email, but the first email reply didn't get on the message board.

Hi Alan,

You've obviously looked everywhere I did and a whole lot more places besides!

I thought about it a bit more and tried a search on rootsireland for births/baptisms of James Smith father George born 1858 + - 10 years in the same counties as we got the Mary births - Derry & Armagh but got nothing!!

I had a quick look at the ships list and found a family that came out from Denbigshire, England on the Monsoon arriving in SA 17 March 1857: John 40 Catherine 36 Edwin 8 and Mary Ann 7.

This would make her 29 when married; did you get her age from the marriage record or elsewher as 21 or so?

Also, where did the brother James idea come from?

Col

Hi again Col,

                       there are two estimates for her age. The marriage certificate gives her age to be 20 years as at 14/4/1879 - so a birth year of 1858 or possibly early 1859.  The death certificate gives her age to be about 40 years as at 29/3/1900, which possibly gives a birth year of 1859 or even 1860.    The only way both can be correct is if she was born between 29/3/1859 and 14/4/1859.  I have checked the data for a birth year of 1860 on Roots Ireland and this gives a few extra possibilities, but the same problems still apply without her place of birth or mothers name.    I now favour the estimates from the marriage certificate as the death certificate data was supplied by her husband and as per an earlier email he appears to have been a bit vague on these issues.

I have tried the shipping records and there are numerous possibilities but again its hard to pin point anything exactly.  One of the problems is that UK migrants at this time were usually on boats bound for Melbourne or Sydney, but some got off in Adelaide where the record keeping seems poor.  The South Aus Genealogy and Heraldry Society tell me that it was common for passengers in steerage to be let ashore without any names being recorded.                     I found quite a good match for a family going to Qld (George, Mary and James Smith), but the BMD data seems to show they all settled in Qld.

 I have also checked the UK census data and found what appeared to be a good match for a family in Cornwall.  However, the family tree data on Ancestry shows that the Mary Smith involved married and stayed in the UK.  To give you some idea of the size of the problem there are over 100 families in the England 1861 census with a Mary Smith b 1858 + _ 1 year and a father of George Smith.

Sorry for all the digressions.  James Smith is mentioned the as the patron (godfather) on the baptismal certificate for Mary Wiese's eldest daughter Mary Lavinia b ca. 1881.  It appears that the baby was not expected to live and a Catholic baptism was performed at home. Mary Wiese is listed as Maria and James is given as Jacobus.  The SAGHS tell me that it was common at that time to change the actual names in this fashion for a Catholic baptism.  They further assure me that Jacobus = James.    Its a bit of a long shot, but James Smith may have been a brother of Mary.

Sorry I have to finish here.    Hope there maybe something of interest to you in all this.

Alan

Hi Alan,

You've obviously thought this case through really well and at the moment I can't think of any other angles or missing steps for you.

I am sure if it can be found you'll find it!

Col

Alan it's a tricky question; there seems to be a bit of variation in the records but given that there is a sale on at the moment it could be worth the risk as there could be a lot to gain.

Col